Should I stop paying the CSA because ex has stopped me seeing my daughter?

July 8, 2012

Hi there. I know this is going to seem like a very selfish thing to write and I’ve already been able to see if from another point of view but i thought i would share this with the community.

I’m 24 years of age and my daughter (Who turned 2 on 24th June) i have not been able to see since June 09 2011. I have been paying CSA every single month and i was alright to be the father to my daughter until it came to 2 weeks before her 1st Birthday. Now i recently found out that my daughter who’m i keep sending presents, cards and even going through private solicitors because i apparently earn too much money is calling another man dad. She is being provided for perfectly and has no recollection of who i am.

I am being forced out of my daughter’s life and replaced so to speak. I am thinking of stopping CSA payments (As they are direct debit) as one i can’t afford to live my own life with the way payments between CSA/Solicitors are going and knowing that unless she suddenly finds out that the other man isn’t her father i’m just a sperm donor as such.

What i’m really wanting the public opinion on is; is it worthwhile me stopping CSA payments and arguing this fact so i can get my own life back on track and be able to afford to actually take her to court?

Or should i continue to live the way i am with no compromise and be known as the “Bad guy” for the rest of her life?

Comments

  • James says:

    The trouble is the CSA will say whether or not you see your daughter you still have to pay, that its not conditional on you seeing your daughter. If you stop payments they will pursue you for the payments. Due to them failing to assess a claim for nearly 5 year they have been deducting 40% of my take home pay since 2008!

  • chall says:

    Robert,

    ‘public opinion’ does not alter your responsibilities.
    If your a child’s parent and the child has not been legally adopted, you remain legally liable to pay maintenance for said child.

    If you choose to cease payments, don’t think the agency will just go away.
    You will more than likely be deemed non compliant and enforcement action will commence.

    Check your weekly liability is correct using the link below
    http://www.cmoptions.org/en/calculator/calculator.asp

    chall ~ afairercsaforall

  • Alice says:

    Sorry to be the bearer of bad news ,but you are the father of the child and you will have to pay till she leaves education.Even if you stop CS you will be chased by the mother and CSA for the amount that is owed and could result in you losing everything anyway.Most NRP’s are paying far to much to the PWC but they have no choice in making the payments.Have you gone on the CSA calculator to see if you would be paying less money and could you not arrange a private payment to the PWC(next year you will be able to do this if you both can come to an agreement).Its sad for you that your daughter will be calling someone else dad ,but at the end of the day you do have to support her and hopefully one day you will have her back in your life calling you dad .

  • lozzi says:

    When a couple split, one side to the story the other side to the story and the truth. Its a shame you have been pushed out but dont allow that to dishearten you, you are the childs father and have a right to contact so i would fight til my last breath if i were in the same position. My childs father doesnt make the effort and he has contact offered on a plate- every situation is different, whatever the situation though it doesnt change your responsibilities as a parent. Do the right thing, continue to pay and continue to fight. you can attempt to request contact without taking legal action so that could save you some pennies:- either way at least you know you are doing what a father should do to the best of your ability even if ex is making it difficult. no one ever said its easy having children, but regardless they shouldnt be dragged into the middle

  • Terry norris says:

    As far as the csa are concerned…you are indeed th ” bad guy” as this fiasco of an organisation brand all NRP automatically as bad.
    As for you stopping payment? Good luck…you will need it mate cause they will hunt you relentlessly and when they do catch up with you back payments will be due from the day you stopped paying and they will probably find extra arrears from know where and slap that on top to…I hear they are experts at this little antic among other fuck ups they are expert at. Rest assured that the csa will ensure you are poor,very poor for yrs to come.you are not allowed a life once the csa get their claws into you.you are not allowed to make up your salary by doing overtime to make up for the shortfall they are robbing from you.they will just take more.it means jack shit that the mother may be with a new partner who is a multi millianare and does not need any other support from anyone but you….despite living in poverty because of the csa will still be screwd for full payment…due….it’s fair I guess ???? Fucking right it’s not…but do they give a shit? Fucking right they don’t.
    Don’t stop paying if you value your sanity and mental health as well as your wallet.

  • Sarah says:

    Hi, totally sympathise with you, but I would certainly heed the warnings given, especially James & the 40% fiasco, yes you may be able to stop paying for a while untill they catch up with you, but rest assured they will. You are just delaying the inevitable. CSA can and do raid your wages/bank account, there are only 2 escapes as far as I can see, one is go work abroad (not going to help you with your daughter contact issues) or 2 go self employed and get yourself a bloody good accountant. I am a PWC and am awaiting the outcome of csa assessment from my self employed ex (who leads a very lavish lifestyle, cars, new work vans, loft conversions, latest electriacal gadgets, designer puppies for the girlfriend etc) who claims to be only earning 6k a year! I am expecting about 9 per week if Im lucky. Thats the way to go my friend! Apparently the new system that is being phased in is now linking CSA directly with the tax man (HMRC) so they dont even need you to supply wage slips or chase you for your address anymore, one click of the mouse and they can see all your employment details etc within seconds making the ‘chasing’ NRP bit one hell of a lot quicker. Still doesnt help me in my situation though lol, when your up against the best accountant a money can buy. Failing that, jack in your job so you can receive legal aid and take your ex to court for contact, then get another job when access set in stone. Good luck.

  • jay says:

    They’l just deduct it from your earnings automatically in a deo. If not you’l end up with an arrears bill, were a second family under the abuse of his ex and the csa, i have a child as well, but it doesn’t matter because the agency seemingly just makes the rules up as they go along and second families with children don’t get a look in, so my daughter has to go with out to give to my husbands two other kids who quite frankly lead a rich luxury life !!!!! It’s all wrong absolutely disgusting.

  • wingnut says:

    Want some real advice mate? take it from someone who’s been through the mire, they’re greatest weapon is fear!
    They will use words like ‘arrears’, ‘debt’, ‘enforcement’, ‘deduction’ etc etc…

    Its like when you get a red letter from credit card company, you see the red header and read the BOLD TYPE KEYWORDS: COURT ACTION/BAILIFFS and you shit a brick and cough up without thinking it through.

    There ARE options:
    1, Avoid – stop using the phone, write to them only. as above their phone patter is very subjective and they use some real obvious techniques like assuming you agree to arrears without reservation. also in writing they normally make so many mistakes i usually just send a copy back to them highlighted.
    2, Remove their raison d etre – just stop working or manage it down, your income is your worst enemy
    3, Work for cash if u can – everyone knows a landscape gardner or a plasterer who needs a hand now and again. this is about survival, reason and logic do not come into this at all.
    4, Go abroad – get a bar job, enjoy the sun for a summer season. this will help you rebuild your confidence and self esteem to come back and deal with the situation.

    BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY SAVE SOME MONEY FOR YOUR KID set up a trust fund that can only be used for higher education (or private health care should the need arise) then when he’s the right age you can give him a fat check and say “he you go son, things havent been the way i wanted but take this and make your future the best it can be”.

    remember there is no statue in law that says you have to remain here getting fucked up the arse week in week out. you only get one life mate, make damn sure you are happy with yours. all the best.

  • Rebecca says:

    Hi Robert, My heart goes out to you, man. I’ve been on both sides of this fence (as a child support receiving and paying parent) and here’s my two bob’s worth.

    Clearly you’re a loving parent who is being worn down by the relentless reality of being a paying parent. And you have a former partner who clearly has their own agenda with regard to your child. You are a good man, caught in a difficult situation. At the end of the day, when your child is an adult, think of how much more integrity you will have if you can say that despite the hardship, you always did your level best to provide financial support.

    Child support: yes, you must pay it, regardless of how mind-bogglinglly unfair the whole situation seems. I know what it’s like, opening the mail to endless bloody statement, notices of assessment, letters etc. However, you’re messing with the tax office, not the CSA, and they have various methods of getting their money out of you. Read the paperwork – for example, they can restrict overseas travel unless your balance is up to date. Try to keep in mind that the money is for your child’s food, clothing and education. And quite honestly, you’d be forking out a whole lot more if your child lived with you – they’re expensive little critters, as we all know.

    Access to the child: the law courts are unfortunately, toothless tigers if the primary parent decides to be tricky with access arrangements etc. Those of us who have been through it know that a court decision / orders are not worth the paper they’re written on, if you’ve got a parent who will essentially do whatever they hell they want, knowing how long and expensive the mediation / court processes are, and how little the courts can do unless the child’s safety is at risk.

    I’ve had similar experiences to what you’re describing, although the detail is different. I can only suggest two things.

    (a) Phone LawAccess NSW – it’s a phone service that I’ve used on and off over the past 8 years. They can talk the issues through with you and give you current, correct information on your options. If nothing else, once you’ve had a giant rant at them (they’re very patient,), they will help you with balanced information – not what you WANT them to say (like your solicitors), but what the REAL story is. For a start, ask them about how you can appeal your CSA amount if your former partner now has a current partner.

    (b) Understand that your former partner might have a strategy, whether they know it or not, to alienate your child from you. If that’s the case, all you can do is wait it out, but there are ways to let your child know you love them unreservedly, and one day, when they’re old enough, you’ll be able to start your relationship again. It’s about educating yourself. Read up on Parental Alienation, websites like Amy Baker (she’s in the States, but info is relevant to parents anywhere). I’ve found this incredibly helpful. It has helped me stop beating up on myself, desparately trying to make things happen that just won’t ever happen, tyring to control things that I can’t control … it allows for some zen, some calm, some understanding of what was/is happening with my own children. PAS – parental alienation syndrome – is an eye opener. I had a conversation recently with a friend – he’s a family law barrister – who said yes, they’re aware of this dynamic but can do very little about it.

    Robert, you ARE a good person. The fact that you’ve put your question on a forum shows that you’re struggling with the frustration, the lack of options, that you’re wanting some input from other people, not just pig-headedly deciding to not pay and damn the consequences.

    If you feel suicidal about it, please for God’s sake phone Lifeline. This whole CSA / no access to children etc. can do your head in. There are dark moments, but please believe me when I say that as time passes, it will seem less critical. Not less frustrating, but definitely less critical.

    Best of luck, I wish you well. This dilemma is not something we would wish on our worst enemy.

  • Mr Anonymous says:

    Haven’t read any of the comments relating to your post, but you might be interested to hear my story.

    I have a little boy and my ex wife has stopped me from seeing him, although this hopefully this should soon change as I have her up in court in the next week or so. There isn’t a good enough reason, without a Dad committing a horrendous child related crime, for a child to be kept from having a relationship with his Dad. A child needs his Dad. So over attention from a load of aunties, Grandma and a deluded Mum is not enough for a child to grow up on.

    I used to have a good job paying a £45k package. The recession bit me and I endured a few hard years of underpaid and overworked jobs so I could be home every night to be with my son and to try to mend our failing marriage. Three years on I have managed to get rid of the wife as she was never going to try to help matters and as I thought she would try to ruin my life through CSA I decided to change careers and go self employed. I have set myself up as limited company (£18 through companies house website), got myself a business bank account and passed my class 1 HGV driving test. I now drive tankers and earn just as much as I did in my previous life. I now pay just £11.63 per week (yes £11.63 per week) to the CSA because being a limited company I only pay myself a directors wage of £620 (loophole alert!). The rest of my bills are paid through me paying myself expenses which are non taxable therefore not taken in to consideration by the CSA. I could have £80k in my business bank account and the CSA couldn’t touch a penny because it belongs to my business. It just so happens that I own that business (booom!)

    I am currently using any monies that she cannot get her grubby hands on to pay for a good solicitor to shaft her in court.

    I took some good advice from a very good friend who went through a similar situation to me. ‘NEVER GIVE IN’ because even though she may be shagging somebody else, your kid will always love you more because you are the kids Dad and that cannot be taken away from you. If you persist through the right channels you will get your kid back. And when your kid is old enough to say ‘Mum why did you do that to my Dad when I was little’, they will make their own path back to you.

    If any Dad hasn’t done this, there is hope for you mate. If you read this and still don’t do anything then for your kids sake pull your finger out of your arse and put the effort in pal? Look forward to the day when you are sat at your sons best table and your ex looks 20 years older than you with her tits dragging on the floor, bags under her eye bags and her arse has fallen out of her skirt. You will be the proudest Dad in the world and your kid will look up to you.

    Mr A.

  • tomy says:

    @Robert

    Its not for the government or the csa to say what our responsibilities are,this
    is what is behind their flawed thinking.If a pwc does not want a nrp
    to have contact with a child,then they can should expect no help.exceptions
    being a background of where harm has been proven to occur in the past,
    Full control should mean full responsibility The proper place for child
    maintenance to be worked out is in a court of law on a case by case basis.
    Child support does not belong in the hands of a bunch of idiots from
    call centers scattered around the country.

  • tomy says:

    @Rebecca

    Quote

    However, you’re messing with the tax office, not the CSA, and they have various methods of getting their money out of you. Read the paperwork – for example, they can restrict overseas travel unless your balance is up to date..

    ———————————————————————————————-

    There is no known passport denial policy based around child support in operation in the UK.There is in the USA.

    http://irdial.com/blogdial/?p=195

    quote

    UK Immigration Requirements for British Citizens

    If I cannot get a passport, I am for all intents and purposes interned in my own country.
    My government cannot deny my travel and/or entry and exit to my own country.
    Therefore it follows: passports must not be required for a British citizen to transit UK borders.

    I wrote to the UK Passport Service and asked them what exactly are “the legal requirements for a UK citizen entering and leaving the UK of their own free will.”

    They replied:

    A person who is a British citizen is not subject to immigration control and is free to enter or leave the United Kingdom without restriction. A British citizen who travels on a passport issued by another country will need to apply for a Certificate of Entitlement to the Right of Abode to be endorsed in his passport to confirm he has unrestricted entry to this country.

    As a British citizen, you do not need a passport to leave the UK, but you will have to prove that you have the right to live in the UK upon your return. blah blah blah

    ———————————————————————————-

    Note

    Although you don’t need a passport to leave the UK finding ferry operator that
    will take you without one is hard..

  • Adrian Knight says:

    Hi

    Been reading the responses and all are correct,

    PUT ALL EMOTIONS AWAY

    1) If you really want to see your child, lose your job, lose your home and be rehoused by the council (unless you have supportive parents) inform the council that you a single parent, whether or not the child is with you at the time of appliucation
    1) If the child benefit is paid into a (then joint bank account) call the child benefit office and get the benefit paid into your bank account in your sole name
    2) Get LEGAL AID
    3) Have contact 50/50
    4) Get a Job (you may by this point be deemed as the parent with care if you are earn away and enjoy as your EX will now be paying YOU CSA

    The above may seem like an awful effort but if you truly do want a relationship with the child it will all be worth it

    Call me 07581018674

    Good Luck

  • Ashleigh says:

    Firstly let me just say well done in doing right by your child and providing for her regardless 2nd get to Citizans advice they deal with family law and will fight for access on ur behalf for free without costing u all ur earnings on bloodthirsty lawyers who take the piss and just bleed u dry,u have the same rights to your child as ur ex so get to cab and start legal war on your ex for being unfit and not looking at what’s best for ur child good luck email me if u need anything else x

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